Ultimate Hulk / Edward Hyde (League of Ex Gentlemen)

I noted with amusement that in the current issue of Alan Moore's League of Extraordinary Gentlemen, Edward Hyde (of Jeckyl and Hyde) threatens to eat his enemies, and mulls over the idea of raping and beheading the female leader of his own group.

This doesn't really speak to arguments about the appropriateness of the Ultimate Hulk's actions/intentions in a supposedly all-ages book, nor the question of faithfulness to the Marvel Universe Hulk. Let's not get into that again. I simply found it to be an interesting parallel

nope, that's the only reason!

I haven't read Ultimates, so I can't make any comparisons, but where I think League succeeds with its own rogues gallery is that there is serious development of character. In these individuals we see flaws not for the sake of having flaws, but rather because they are truly being made individuals. Hyde, for example, was incredible in his scene; I must have read it three times before moving on. He is vile and without conscience, and yet there is more to him than that, something akin to rules that he cannot ignore for his own reasons rather than society's. His reaction to the revelation that she had faced someone even worse than he spoke volumes about who Edward Hyde was. Yes, he's dispicable. Yes, he's a monster. No, I cannot justify his actions. But there is something in Hyde that would make the League that much the poorer without him.

rose up with the following chant:

I don't think so. What people seem to be objecting to in the Hulk's case, is not the existence of psychotic monsters in comic books; it's a Marvel writer taking a known and beloved character who likes beans and puppy dogs, and turning him into a psycho.

I've read all the League issues. It's a good enough read, but it kind of reminds me of those horrible JLA Elseworlds stories where the Justice League is formed in 1890. Having the Hyde monster team up with *anyone* stretches credibility a bit.

<< Having the Hyde monster team up with *anyone* stretches credibility a bit. >>

Even the Cobra?

Yes...

The Hulk has a history of behavior since 1963. While there are gradual permutations, the character has more or less been portrayed consistantly. If you are going to update a character, it would probably be best to do it the proper way. The Hulk is also a member of juvinile fiction.

Moore's characterization is consistant with the novels of classic literature. Millar's is more 'screw with it for the sake of screwing with it, probably mostly for shock value'.

Note that Moore doesn't write Tom Strong in that dark way.

The Ultimate's sell well, but I believe they are selling to the following people: * Jaded comics fans, who are looking for an 'elseworlds' style Marvel * Rebels who are familiar with the superheroes, but like it for the shock value and the rejection of the traditional values that made the superheroes

I enjoy The Ulitmates, but I don't fit into either group. I agree that the 'shock' value is sometimes played up too much, but it somehow manages to work instead of detracting. At least for me.

I just find it to be a well written book with good art that is consistentlly enjoyable from month to month.

Am I upset how these character differ from their mainstream counterparts? No, because in spite of a few superficial similarities these are not the same characters. I don't see this as cheap revisionism as the orginals are left untouched.

This isn't a book for kids. But then it doesn't claim to be or is marketed for them. I would say this is the most honest of the Ultimate line titles. People unfamiliar to comics are not picking up these books. Th people picking these books up are the same people who have been picking up comics for the last 20 years. So this book is aimed at them.

The Ultimates and the entire Ultimate line can not save the comic book industry. It is just more of the same. That is recycled stories told to the same audience. Over and over and over again until fans take over creative chore, the industry bloats and sags, then collapses in on itself.

I don't really fit either of those categories either. I read Ultimates because it's a fresh look at some heroes that could use updating, but I'm too thick-headed to accept that either. I still read Avengers and Captain America, so I'm not really jaded on those books, I just like the angle that Ultimates takes. These characters are all deeply flawed because Millar is going on the theory that anyone who does what they do MUST have some deep flaws. Flaws like deep-seated insecurities, shame, guilt, those are all touched on in the regular universe, but not to the extent that Millar does. That's because in the regular universe the flaws don't balance out or justify the reaction, which is putting on a costume and running around. Then there are the so-called selfless heroes like Captain America. I like that he's got other reasons for doing things than just loving America.

I find it interesting that even with all the criticism of this book, it's still one of the best selling and most talked about titles in a long time. People just love to hate things.

This pretty much sums up the double audience I was targeting.

What really NEEDS to be done is the type of revamp we have with X-Men Evolution, rather than something this destructive. I watch X-Men Evolution and see a positive approach to modernizing the characters, while still keeping as much of the traditional storylines that were of interest. The Ultimate line should have gone /that/ way, rather than letting the current ultimate crop take hold.

Some of us have noted for years that Alan Moore is not particularly good at keeping other people's characters in character, whether it's Dorothy Gale in the LOST GIRLS or the various DC superheroes in the Twilight proposal or the way he's writing LEAGUE. However, he and his publisher aren't promising that they're taking those characters back to their core concepts, either. Marvel did, with the Ultimate line.

Ultimates seem to be retreading old ground for Millar. Already, like X-men they are now celebs. This, I know seems normal, because almost everyone is a celeb who gets famous, but it just feels samey.